Remote Rig

RRC 1258 Support in English => Configuration, RRC 1258 => Topic started by: W3IP on 2015-01-02, 16:48:49

Title: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: W3IP on 2015-01-02, 16:48:49
I am experiencing a problem when using the Remote Rig Winkeyer with
N1MMPlus. N1MM hangs after sending CW characters to the Winkeyer to
transmit using the function keys. After posing this problem to the N1MM forum, I was told that
N1MM expects to see status bytes from the Winkeyer ( one saying that
sending CW has started, and another when sending is complete) before it
will issue another CW message. Using a USB monitor program, I can see the
setup sent from N1MM to the Winkeyer (0A 16 00 16 02 00 1C 16), then I see
the characters to be transmitted and the character echos back from the Winkeyer.
I see neither status byte from the Winkeyer to N1MM on the USB monitor. If I
read the Winkeyer manual correctly, the start of transmit status byte would be
C4, the end of transmission status byte would then be C0).

Is there some setup function I am missing? The rest of the interface
between N1MM, the K3/0, the Remote Rig and the K3 is working well.

Using WinXP, Remote Rig Version 5, HW 6, Software 2.81, K3/0,
K3 (with most recent updates).

Thanks

73, Mike, W3IP
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: W3IP on 2015-01-08, 04:32:48
Has anyone had success or failure with N1MMPlus and the RRC1258 Twins using the
CW message function keys in N1MMPlus? As configured, the first time I click on
a function key, the characters are transmitted, the red "LED light" on the N1MM
entry panel turns orange and stays that way. Subsequent clicks on the CW message
buttons do nothing.

Any secret to getting this to work?

Thanks

73, Mike, W3IP
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: W1UE on 2015-01-10, 02:27:00
Mike-  I have had this happen to me several times in different configurations.  It sounds like a conflict among virtual serial port programs.  Do you have any other programs on your computer that create virtual serial ports?  Some programs to check for are the Microham virtual serial port creator,  Microbit, VSPR, N8VB, com0com, or even a USB to serial converter.  What happens is that the methods that the different programs use to create the virtual comports are not compatible; the communication from N1MM goes out to the Winkey, but the end info doesn't come back.  Another way to test if that is the problem is to hit the ESC key when it doesn't release the PTT (sometimes you have to hit it twice)- if that then restores the function keys, it is most likely a virtual serial port problem issue.

The solution: eliminate all the virtual serial port creators with the exception of the one you want to use (Microbit).  It often isn't enough to not use the program; you often have to uninstall it from the computer.  If that solves your problem, then you'll know that's the problem.

I spent several hours today trying to get the Winkeyer emulation in the RCC to work with no luck.  I couldn't get the Winkey emulation to be saved; I could change it, but when I went to Apply it the Com2 always came back as "parallel to Com0".  I could get it to save as Com1, but then I couldn't get radio control for N1MM.  I finally had to resort to an outboard USB winkey.  BTW, setup here is a K3 Mini 0 Control Unit to a Remote K3. 

Dennis W1UE
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: W3IP on 2015-01-10, 04:31:56
Dennis

After my initial attempts to get N1MMPlus and Remoterig CW messaging to work together failed, I completely
uninstalled the other virtual serial port drivers that were loaded on my computer, removed the
one USB to serial adapter, and also ran the Microbit device driver remover program that Jan
from Microbit published on this forum back in June. The Windows device manager confirmed that
all the virtual device drivers and the USB to serial adapter were gone. I then did a clean install
of the software (version 2.83). The four Microbit USB ports and drivers showed up (now with lower Com port numbers) as advertised in device manager. There are no other ports visible in device manager. The problem between N1MMPlus and the RRC1258 remains unchanged as stated.

To recap my observations:
1. With the K3, RRC1258 and N1MMPlus otherwise properly configured and in CW mode, I can click on any
CW function message key in N1MMPlus and observe one CW message transmitted, the red "LED" on the N1MMPlus entry window turns orange and does NOT return to red when the CW message transmission is complete.
2. Hitting the escape key on the keyboard does NOT reset N1MMPlus to send more CW messages.
3. Clicking on "Esc:Stop" on the N1MMPlus entry window does NOT reset N1MMPlus to send more CW messages.
4. Hitting "Cntl T" twice while focused on N1MMPlus (i.e. toggle tune twice) DOES reset N1MMPlus to send
one more CW message then hang again. (I believe this is the equivalent of a manual PTT in N1MMPlus and
resets the software, but is not a usable solution in a contest scenario).

I would like to hear from Microbit whether or not they are following the Winkey protocol regarding status
bytes and whether or not their latest device drivers can handle the extended ASCII characters. I have
heard that some recent versions of some virtual port drivers do not handle extended ASCII. Those answers
would go a long way towards isolating where to look for the problem.

Can you (or anyone else) think of anything else to look for? Has anyone gotten these CW function keys in N1MMPlus to work with the RRC1258?

Thanks

73, Mike, W3IP
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: Jan (Microbit) on 2015-01-10, 06:58:28
I spent several hours today trying to get the Winkeyer emulation in the RCC to work with no luck.  I couldn't get the Winkey emulation to be saved; I could change it, but when I went to Apply it the Com2 always came back as "parallel to Com0".  I could get it to save as Com1, but then I couldn't get radio control for N1MM.  I finally had to resort to an outboard USB winkey.  BTW, setup here is a K3 Mini 0 Control Unit to a Remote K3. 
Dennis W1UE
When settings "revert" that way it is most likely due to the new value being incompatible with other settings and so the  RRC will not allow the change to take effect. In an ideal world the RRC would somehow tell about why it does that, but since resources are small such a feature is yet to be implemented.
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: Jan (Microbit) on 2015-01-10, 07:07:47
I would like to hear from Microbit whether or not they are following the Winkey protocol regarding status
bytes and whether or not their latest device drivers can handle the extended ASCII characters. I have
heard that some recent versions of some virtual port drivers do not handle extended ASCII. Those answers
would go a long way towards isolating where to look for the problem.
I was about to ask you to try RRC v2.83 since it contains a fix regarding USB Com ports, which depending on the mode used could have been the reason. But since you have upgraded and still have problems it was not the case.

The drivers used for the RRC's USB serial ports are from Microsoft. We only provide INF files which describes the ports so that Windows can locate and use those drivers. There is no problem with extended ASCII since the valid range of data for each byte is 0-255.

As for the Winkey protocol and testing this ourselves that will be next week, unless Mike(@RemoteRig) knows something about it.
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: K3TN on 2015-01-10, 15:20:48
I've duplicated Mike's problem with my Remote Rig setup - with N1MM+, the function keys won't send CW.

With old N1MM (called Classic), it works fine. N2IC on the N1MM team seems to say that N1MM+ is looking for status byte return, that doesn't seem to happen in RemoteRig WinKey emulation, maybe?

So, for Microbit testing - use N1MM+ to see problem.

John K3TN
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: sm2o on 2015-01-12, 14:16:30
Hi
We will take a look at it as soon as we get time for it.

73 de mike
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: EI3KD on 2015-01-13, 06:53:07
I have the same problem with N1MM+

Having looked at the serial data flow, perhaps the remoterig winkey implementation is not quite complete...

A standard K1EL winkeyer2 sends an "Unsolicited Status Transmission" (UST) containing the status byte, whenever the winkey status changes: This includes information such as whether the keyer is currently busy sending Morse, paddle break-in is active, etc. It seems like the remoterig implementation doesn't send this status update - the only UST it sends is to do with speed control.

I think N1MM+ uses the UST status update (in WK1 compatible mode?) as a form of "software flow control" and consequently doesn't work properly when it's not being sent.

I hope this helps - the required fix is probably in remoterig's implementation rather than N1MM+

Regards, Mark
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: Jan (Microbit) on 2015-01-20, 15:39:52
Thanks for your information and help regarding the issues with N1MM+ and RemoteRig.

The UST byte seems to be what was missing in order to satisfy N1MM+. There is a new version available here:

www.remoterig.com/firmwares/RRC1258-CRC-v2.84_2015-01-20.zip (http://www.remoterig.com/firmwares/RRC1258-CRC-v2.84_2015-01-20.zip)

for you to try and see if it works ok  8)
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: EI3KD on 2015-01-20, 17:48:12
Thanks Jan,

that works fine for me with N1MM+, tested today with version 1.0.4584. I've also checked it still works with the latest versions of  WinTest, cwType and DxLog.

Great job!

Mark
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: W3IP on 2015-01-21, 05:40:00
Works well here also. Thanks for the great support!

73, Mike, W3IP
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: Jan (Microbit) on 2015-01-21, 11:20:35
Excellent! And thanks again!  ;D
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: K3TN on 2015-01-21, 11:42:54
Thanks! Will load here today.

73 John K3TN
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: OH2FT on 2015-01-21, 13:17:38
Any "KISS" type configuring instructions how to use
USB to RRC Control, to run wintest with winkey emulation
and PTT over it, and use the internal RRC keyer in parallel with paddle ?

An other PC uses both RS232 ports of RRC to control K3 and a microham stack switch.

Joni OH2FT
(yes, winkey was invented after I left school...)
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: OH2FT on 2015-01-23, 10:43:46
Winkey output from win-test over USB works with RRC keyer and paddle over com 3 !
However, I haven't figured out how to forward PTT signal over com 3, only coms 0/1/2 are selectable
from I/O page. I want a separate PC for win-test and an other PC for CAT etc (RS232 modes 3 and 4 in use).

In addition, if mode 8 in com 3 is configured, but the usb cable is not in place, and you transmit with
paddle and use hand mic PTT, PTT hangs on extra 5 seconds after transmission, probably wondering where the missing winkey signal was...

Joni OH2FT 
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: w4rm on 2015-01-24, 20:07:34
Which is the prefer side to install the winkeyer?  Remote or control?

My control is currently sending the CW via the CAT port and its not perfect.  I want to install my winkeyer back into my remote set-up that it was remove when I configured the K3 for remote.

Will this help my control side CW that's being transmitted?

I was running  a laptop and N1MM+ last night in the 160M contest and I we repeatedly sent the other person call sign as if I send it back in my exchange incorrectly.  By changing the delay settings and moving up to 30WPMs it seemed to help but I'm hoping that the winkey will also help on the remote side.

Thanks for any help
73 Bill  W4RM
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: dj0qn on 2015-01-24, 21:38:38
Bill,

They are referring to the built-in Winkeyer emulation in the RRC. You need to select Winkeyer (or FSK)
in the control RRC serial settings under COM3. Then use the COMEXTRA serial port in Windows as
the Winkeyer in your program.

73,
Mitch DJ0QN / K7DX
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: w4rm on 2015-01-25, 14:44:12
What is the proper set-up configuration for Winkey?      (I'm using K3/0 Mini with 1258MKII twins, laptop at the control side with N1MM+ and K3 K-line at the remote site (Local LAN at present).

Install at the Control or remote site?

Install Winkey on COM 1 , 2 o3 ... doesn't matter?

What is the main reason for using winkey?      Is it to get N1MM (from control side) to send the data across the network and get the remote side Winkey to generate the CW?   By getting the remote side to generate the data to ensure purity of the CW being transmitted?

I'm ran the 160M contest over the weekend with the above set-up and had lots of people send me their callsign again as what I sent them was incorrect, I did copy it correctly, (CW was being generated from the control side laptop on the KAT port within N1MM+).

I'm assuming this is what driving people to install the Winkey?

Thanks for everyone's help

73 Bill  W4RM


Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: dj0qn on 2015-01-25, 14:53:52
I already described how to use Winkeyer in my last posting. It is not complicated, just use the virtual port in
Windows after changing COM3 over in the control RRC.

The reason for using is that some software has problems keying over CAT and that gets around that problem,
plus other preferences that some may have for Winkeyer. There is no difference from using the normal method
of generating CW over the RRC's, but with some software (like N1MM), it is easier to key using the Winkeyer
emulation.

73,
Mitch DJ0QN / K7DX
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: EI3KD on 2015-01-28, 08:59:12
V2.84 firmware has fixed the general interaction problem with N1MM+, but I've just found another small problem: Once a message has been started, e.g. "CQ EI3KD EI3KD TEST", it cannot be interrupted using the manual paddles - this is true with N1MM+ and WinTest, at least.

I'm not sure if there's still some problem with a UST byte being required to indicate the paddles are activated (I didn't check whether remoterig sends this?), but "Paddle Input Priority" is also a feature of Winkeyer2: "Winkeyer2 accepts input from either its serial port or iambic paddle. The paddle will always take priority and will interrupt serial data, automatically clearing Winkeyer2ís serial input buffer. When a paddle break-in occurs, any additional serial data that arrives from the host will be processed, but will be ignored unless it is an immediate command. After paddling ceases, Winkeyer2 will pause for one word space time before it resumes serial data transmission."

It would be nice if this was working properly, but perhaps it's not feasible?

Regards, Mark
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: Jan (Microbit) on 2015-01-29, 16:45:52
Thank you for pointing out that there are more issues regarding the WinKeyer "emulation".

Please give this new beta version a try and see if it works better(and that it has not regressed either!)

http://www.remoterig.com/firmwares/RRC1258-CRC-v2.85_2015-01-29-BETA.zip (http://www.remoterig.com/firmwares/RRC1258-CRC-v2.85_2015-01-29-BETA.zip)

 8)
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: EI3KD on 2015-01-29, 17:57:47
Hi Jan,

once again thanks for looking at this!

The beta version worked as far as interrupting the serial cw using manual paddles - but at some point while I was testing it (using N1MM+) the remoterig control box "crashed", i.e. it restarted as if just powering up. That's the first time it's ever done that, so I guess there's something not quite right in that version. I'm trying to pin down whether I can reproduce it exactly, but in the meantime other people should be careful about using that file!

Regards, Mark
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: EI3KD on 2015-01-29, 18:46:08
Ok, I wonder if this helps? I found this message when I went to my remoterig control box's web page:

Saved error message:
Data Abort at 0x00038e88, called by 0x00038ff4


I can reproduce the problem but it's very contrived and seems peculiar to something N1MM+ does, because I can't reproduce it in WinTest. Unfortunately, it's also in firmware V2.84 :(

I can try and give more detail if required (or perhaps capture the serial data?), but briefly (with N1MM+ V1.0.4616.0):

1) N1MM+ menu Config/"CW Autosend Threshold" set to 1.

2) N1MM+ in Run mode, Rig in CW.

3) Type F1TTT in call entry window: N1MM+ (and hence the winkeyer) starts sending after the "F1T" is entered, and sends the complete exchange - in my case that is "F1TTT 001 IO51VW". Actually, for some reason it only sends F1TT as the call but with the correct exchange, but that might be a different problem?

4) Don't log the QSO, instead hit F12 to wipe it.

5) Enter F1TTT in call entry window (again) - no cw is sent (it should be...) and the remoterig control box reboots.

I can't help feeling that this winkeyer stuff is causing you more trouble than it's worth, sorry!

Regards, Mark
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: Jan (Microbit) on 2015-02-04, 10:36:46
Hi Mark (and others),

Thanks for testing and giving detailed explanations about how to reproduce the issues you have seen!  8)

After digging deeper into this it seems the crash was caused by the "buffer pointer manipulation commands" used by N1MM+(and maybe N1MM too). Also those commands were the reason "on the fly editing" did not send all characters.

Reading the Winkeyer documentation it seemed not that difficult to change the RRC's handling of those commands so it would work, but it was not that easy since what the documentation calls "overwrite" actually seems to be what I would call "insert"(in the context of how to handle characters after getting a "buffer pointer overwrite command"). The Winkeyer documentation also refers to a "Application note" which should elaborate on the subject of the "buffer pointer manipulation commands, but we have not been able to find it.

So what has been done is handling "overwrite" as "insert", and "append" as "overwrite". The  "overwrite" as "insert" seems to be the right way to deal with it since N1MM+ now works with "on the fly editing". But "insert" as "append" is not verified since we have not been able to force N1MM+(or any other software) to send that command.

WinTest, and other software, do no use the "buffer pointer manipulation commands" at all, so they worked ok.

There is a new 2.85 Beta for you to test here:

http://www.remoterig.com/firmwares/RRC1258-CRC-v2.85_2015-02-04-BETA.zip (http://www.remoterig.com/firmwares/RRC1258-CRC-v2.85_2015-02-04-BETA.zip)

It's a rather "heavy" redesign of the Winkeyer support so please keep your eyes open on other things than just "on the fly editing"  ;)
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: EI3KD on 2015-02-04, 15:54:18
Many thanks Jan,

it's early days yet, but I've been testing the winkeyer emulation in your latest beta today and it's looking great with N1MM+ V1.0.4646.0. None of the previous problems I had are there, no box crashes, N1MM+ auto-send is working perfectly, and I haven't found anything new... so far! I'll try a bit harder to break it ;)

I've tried quick tests in DxLog and WinTest, which also seem fine. There are so many different contexts, hopefully a few others will check it out for their particular setup too...

Regards, Mark
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: K3TN on 2015-02-05, 00:00:46
I am going to load this beta, as just ran into the problem today in the CWT contest. All of a sudden N1MM CW send would not work the way it used to  - if I hit Enter to start sending and kept typing in remainder of the call, it would not send the additional characters. I will try this beta tonight.
73 John K3TN
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: Jan (Microbit) on 2015-02-05, 08:59:20
Many thanks Jan,

it's early days yet, but I've been testing the winkeyer emulation in your latest beta today and it's looking great with N1MM+ V1.0.4646.0. None of the previous problems I had are there, no box crashes, N1MM+ auto-send is working perfectly, and I haven't found anything new... so far! I'll try a bit harder to break it ;)

I've tried quick tests in DxLog and WinTest, which also seem fine. There are so many different contexts, hopefully a few others will check it out for their particular setup too...

Regards, Mark
Great!

How about the CW speed? Another user reported that it seems to only send the first character using the N1MM+ speed and then revert to the speed set by the RRC. I do not see how that could be possible though.
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: Jan (Microbit) on 2015-02-05, 09:06:33
I am going to load this beta, as just ran into the problem today in the CWT contest. All of a sudden N1MM CW send would not work the way it used to  - if I hit Enter to start sending and kept typing in remainder of the call, it would not send the additional characters. I will try this beta tonight.
73 John K3TN
It sounds less likely that the "on the fly" issue could be the cause since it happened suddenly. If so then N1MM must have changed from not using the "buffer pointer commands" used in "on the fly" scenarios to using them, just like that  ;)
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: K3TN on 2015-02-05, 12:24:43
The "all of a sudden" I mentioned really meant "the first time I used N1MM+ in a contest where I called CQ, the problem happened..."!

I loaded the latest 2.85 beta and it seems to have fixed the problem - if I am calling CQ and K4RUM calls me,  I can type in K4RU hit enter. N1MM will start to send and I can enter the last letter M and N1MM+ will send K4RUM - all is good.

I tested it out a bit last night in the CWT test it worked fine, but I was able to cause one bad crash. Not quite sure, I couldn't seem to repeat it, but it crashed N1MM and trashed my Com Ports, had to restart PC.

I *think* the actions that caused the crash: I called CQ (hitting F1), W3ABC answers. I start typing W3AB and then hit SPACEBAR by mistake, which advances cursor to next entry box (in this case that is the NAME field). Hitting SPACEBAR doesn't not initiate response, so I hit ENTER key - kerplooey. The ability to keep entering a callsign while CW is being sent I think should only happen after the ENTER key or LOG command is given - the cursor is still in the callsign entry box. If the cursor has been advanced, should not be going back to callsign  buffer unless cursor was moved back there.

I dunno if that makes sense - tonight will try it again in the NS Sprint and see what happens.

Thanks for all the updates on this.

73 John K3TN
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: K3TN on 2015-02-05, 12:25:34
The "all of a sudden" I mentioned really meant "the first time I used N1MM+ in a contest where I called CQ, the problem happened..."!

I loaded the latest 2.85 beta and it seems to have fixed the problem - if I am calling CQ and K4RUM calls me,  I can type in K4RU hit enter. N1MM will start to send and I can enter the last letter M and N1MM+ will send K4RUM - all is good.

I tested it out a bit last night in the CWT test it worked fine, but I was able to cause one bad crash. Not quite sure, I couldn't seem to repeat it, but it crashed N1MM and trashed my Com Ports, had to restart PC.

I *think* the actions that caused the crash: I called CQ (hitting F1), W3ABC answers. I start typing W3AB and then hit SPACEBAR by mistake, which advances cursor to next entry box (in this case that is the NAME field). Hitting SPACEBAR doesn't not initiate response, so I hit ENTER key - kerplooey. The ability to keep entering a callsign while CW is being sent I think should only happen after the ENTER key or LOG command is given - the cursor is still in the callsign entry box. If the cursor has been advanced, should not be going back to callsign  buffer unless cursor was moved back there.

I dunno if that makes sense - tonight will try it again in the NS Sprint and see what happens.

Thanks for all the updates on this.

73 John K3TN
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: Jan (Microbit) on 2015-02-05, 12:34:03
OK John  8)

As for the N1MM+ crash I do not see how the RRC could have caused it. Seems more like a problem within N1MM+ itself.

But the COM port giving up when that happened is (sadly) what normally happens when a program does not close a USB based COM port correctly. It might work to temporarily unplug the RRC's USB cable as Windows then has to re-enumerate the USB COM port.
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: K3TN on 2015-02-05, 22:28:11
Yes, agree - that crash was probably an N1MM crash.

Been playing with it a lot - I have hit a WinKey issue: N1MM has CW speed control and WinKey has a potentiometer for speed control. There seems to be some interaction happening - change speed on N1MM and it starts a message at the N1MM speed but then starts sending at the RRC CW potentiometer setting, or just ignores one of the other.

N1MM has a "ignore WinKey speed control" setting. Tried turning that on but doesn't seem to cure the problem.

Is there a RRC setting to essentially disable the hardware speed control? Or have programmatic control take precedence cleanly?
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: Jan (Microbit) on 2015-02-06, 14:09:16
OK, folks - here we go again with a new attempt!  ;)

www.remoterig.com/firmwares/RRC1258-CRC-v2.85_2015-02-06-BETA.zip (http://www.remoterig.com/firmwares/RRC1258-CRC-v2.85_2015-02-06-BETA.zip)

Thanks to you John and also to Frank I managed to find (and fix it seems) what caused the RRC to return to hardware speed control under certain conditions. I did not see it at first as it took a certain location of the RRC's speed pot to see it. It should now be possible to either set the speed using the pot or from for ex. N1MM+.
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: K3TN on 2015-02-06, 18:42:40
Thanks, Jan - i will load that version and try. I think I have also found another CW keying problem, perhaps this is related:

In N1MM+, in S&P mode in a Sprint contest I answer a CQ by hitting enter and it sends my call. The other station sends their info, I enter it and hit enter - N1MM+ sends my info by sending the F2 exchange message. I wait for the other station to acknowledge, he does and I hit enter which should send CQ - nothing happens. No Fkeys work - unless I hit a dit on the paddle and then the CQ starts.

The F2 message ends in the {RUN} macro, which tells N1MM+ to go to RUN mode - it does that. But that seems to then prevent Fkeys from sending unless I hit the paddle. I also found if a put a spurious character (like an e for a single dit) after the {RUN} command, it would send that dit and then the F Keys *would* work - just as if I hit the paddle!

Or this might be related to my other posted problem, where using the {END} and {CAT1ASC} macros seem to prevent cw from being sent.
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: K3TN on 2015-02-06, 18:57:06
Jan - very quick test here at lunch time: that build seems to have fixed the WinKey pot issue. I can choose to ignore the pot, or only use it for paddle and keyboard and use N1MM for Fkey speed!

It also seems to have fixed the "need to send a dit" issue in my last post! Tried that several times, seems to be working. Will pound on it more since the CW Sprint is tomorrow night and want to be rock solid.

It did *not* however solve the {END}{CAT1ASC} issue in my other post :(

Thanks for all these rapid fixes!

73 John K3TN
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: dl2cc on 2015-02-06, 20:39:17
just testing this with N1MM+, latest Version.

Speed issue fixed! Thanks.
But:
Unfortunately remoterig crashes after a few characters of sending, Setting the K3 to transmit and rebooting, loosing the CAT / COM Connections...
I flashed the Radio site with the same Version btw.
Sorry!
73

Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: Jan (Microbit) on 2015-02-06, 21:50:51
This is starting to get ridiculous...  ::) For every issue I find it seems to pop up one or even two or more.

The most surprising is the reboots the RRC seems to do in ways that are not easily re-produced either. It "smells" timing issues and/or combinations of commands issued I have not tested. Since I am a novice at using this kind of software it is very helpful if you find ways of re-producing the things you encounter, and them describes as detailed as possible what you did.


Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: K3TN on 2015-02-07, 12:12:06
I am not seeing the crashing after a few characters of sending, but tonight will get a major test in the 4 hour NA Sprint!
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: dl2cc on 2015-02-08, 08:20:01
I am sorry Jan about that.
I switched on the remoterig device half an hour ago and was not able to reproduce the error so far.
The only thing I've tuned the Audio jitter buffer Settings a bit (bigger buffer / more delay).
But that is probably unrelated.
So at least for now it's looking good.

Anyway, here is one more:
I just sent an E-Mail to N2IC who handles the Serial stuff in N1MM+ - I found another thing which might be totally unrelated to RemoteRig - if you try to use the "PTT via Radio command CW mode" Setting on the K3 PTT hangs 8 out of 10 times when using WinKey.
PTT stays on indefinitely after sending.  Let's see what he replies, maybe indeed a N1MM+ issue.


73
Frank DL2CC



Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: K3TN on 2015-02-09, 11:54:05
I ran the latest beta firmware in the 4 hour NA CW Sprint this past Saturday night. That contest hardware and software the most of any contest (although only over 4 hours) as there is constant QSYing and calling and speeds are 30+ wpm. I made 290 QSOs in my first remote effort, down a bit from when I am physically at the station but i think the speed of the Sprint does penalize  you for any delays.

I had one N1MM+ crash - a bad one, related to moving between entry window boxes when hitting enter - that I don't think had anything to do with RemoteRig.

The CW sending worked flawlessly - type ahead worked, hitting F1 or Enter multiple times never failed, etc. - fantastic.

One possible small thing: it seems when I first start N1MM+,nothing happens the first time I hit an Fkey. The second time it works and then works continuously there after.

On the END, CATDELAY and CAT1ASC issues - I left those in and during the 4  hours there were perhaps 3-5 times when those commands worked! So, sometimes they are getting passed on to the K3 but very rarely.

Once again, thanks for all the effort on the WinKey sending with N1MM+ - if I couldn't break it during the CW Sprint, it is pretty hard to break!

73 John K3TN
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: Jan (Microbit) on 2015-02-10, 11:31:49
Well, I found a nasty not-always-there-bug which caused the RRC to reboot when using N1MM+'s "on-the-fly-editing" feature, but I seem to have got rid of it in this version:

http://www.remoterig.com/firmwares/RRC1258-CRC-v2.85_2015-02-10-BETA.zip (http://www.remoterig.com/firmwares/RRC1258-CRC-v2.85_2015-02-10-BETA.zip)

Crossing my fingers that it will work now! (Though I am not sure I've addressed all issues, as there are too many issues going on simultaneously!  ;) )
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: Jan (Microbit) on 2015-02-13, 09:25:38
Well, I found a nasty not-always-there-bug which caused the RRC to reboot when using N1MM+'s "on-the-fly-editing" feature, but I seem to have got rid of it in this version:

http://www.remoterig.com/firmwares/RRC1258-CRC-v2.85_2015-02-10-BETA.zip (http://www.remoterig.com/firmwares/RRC1258-CRC-v2.85_2015-02-10-BETA.zip)

Crossing my fingers that it will work now! (Though I am not sure I've addressed all issues, as there are too many issues going on simultaneously!  ;) )
No one have given the new version a try?
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: K3TN on 2015-02-13, 12:56:55
i will be able to test it this afternoon US East Coast time. I think I actually had that crash the other day.

73 John K3TN
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: W1UE on 2015-02-13, 15:37:19
I just downloaded and installed the Beat 2.85.  I'll be using it the rest of the weekend and reporting back any problems.
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: K3TN on 2015-02-16, 21:35:32
I ran it the new load constantly over the weekend during the CQ WPX RTTY, but mostly running N1MM classic and no CW. No problems. Outside of the contest, I ran N1MM+ on the new firmware and had no problems but not exhaustive testing by any means.
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: K3TN on 2015-02-17, 22:49:58
Running the latest beta firmware, using N1MM Classic, I seem to have FKey problems. Works fine now with N1MM+ but N1MM Classic has some issues with the new load.

When sending CW using Fkeys, all will go well for a while and then Fkeys will stop working. Hitting the paddle to send a dit will cause the unsent Fkey messages to all of a sudden be sent.

It sort of seems like the Winkey handling for N1MM+ has caused the issue to happen with Classic.

I have to run old N1MM Classic for multi-op setup at K4VV, so maybe I should revert back to 2.84 for that operation?
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: Jan (Microbit) on 2015-02-18, 07:58:18
Running the latest beta firmware, using N1MM Classic, I seem to have FKey problems. Works fine now with N1MM+ but N1MM Classic has some issues with the new load.

When sending CW using Fkeys, all will go well for a while and then Fkeys will stop working. Hitting the paddle to send a dit will cause the unsent Fkey messages to all of a sudden be sent.

It sort of seems like the Winkey handling for N1MM+ has caused the issue to happen with Classic.

I have to run old N1MM Classic for multi-op setup at K4VV, so maybe I should revert back to 2.84 for that operation?
I do not like things to be like that, i.e having to use an older FW version to get N1MM Classic to work. But I will not be able to debug the issue unless you help me with as detailed instructions as possible how to reproduce it. (Remember that I know very little about how to use programs like N1MM!  ;) )
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: K3TN on 2015-02-18, 12:00:24
Thanks, Jan - OK, here's how I can reproduce the problem:

Running N1MM "Classic" (the old version, last one issued) in Enter Sends Message Mode.

Fkeys are set up in the typical contest fashon: F1 is CQ, F2 is Exchange, F3 is TU

Call CQ by hitting F1. Enter a call sign hit Enter - exchange in F2 is sent.

Enter the other stations exchange, hit Enter - TU K3TN is sent (or whatever you have in F3)

Repeat, now either just by entering call signs as if someone came back to your TU, or hitting Enter again to send a CQ.

After a few "QSOs" when  you hit Enter, nothing gets sent. If you then tap a dit on the paddle, the dit gets sent *and* then the Fkey message that should have gone out when  you hit Enter. If, as often happens, I hit Enter twice or tried another Fkey to see if it would work before hitting the paddle, all of the unsent messages are sent once you hit the paddle.

I did not see this behavior in the WPX RTTY contest last week, using same version of N1MM Classic and the new firmware. But that was RTTY, and had COM3 set up for FSK. I switched it back to Winkey mode - I don't think I changed anything else - or is there something I may have done going CW to FSK and back over COM3? I didn't see anything.
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: Jan (Microbit) on 2015-02-26, 16:09:09
Got time to have another attempt at looking at this, but I must fail setting up N1MM as nothing at all is sent when I follow your instructions  ;) The only Winkeyer commands that N1MM issues are PTT ON/OFF(besides a bunch of setup commands when starting it).
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: K3TN on 2015-02-26, 16:20:53
Thanks, Jan - per the other thread on COM0 RTS/CTS, the problem seems to have gone away after I changed COM0 RTS/CTS to OFF. Not sure what your setting for that was in this test.

Is there a use case where I would need COM0 RTS/CTS to be ON?

Thanks, John K3TN
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: sm2o on 2015-02-27, 11:39:00
The only application Im aware of so far is if you want to control a Expert 1K-FA PA over com1, then the RTS is used by the PC-software to power on the PA.

73 de mike
Title: Re: Remote Rig Winkeyer and N1MMPlus
Post by: K3TN on 2015-02-27, 13:35:34
Thanks - that is definitely not the case for me, so I will make sure that setting stays off as it seems to cause me problems.